Home » General Discussions » General Discussion » Apocalypse Rising released?
| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #471135 is a reply to message #470692] |
Tue, 10 July 2012 11:55   |
triattack
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| One Winged Angel wrote on Wed, 04 July 2012 06:36 |
ECW is definitely outperforming Battle For Dune and Scud Storm, since I haven't heard anything from those guys for ages.
So I guess your comment was aimed at the games that I just mentioned?
By the way, I don't see you on their staff page at all. Are you actually on their team or what?
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i must say that BFD is moving forward again this year some custom scripts are done Venom made some really nice models (see latest blog). and you can't call Scud Storm a mod with a team tbh it's mostly a one man job (and there is some really nice stuff for the next release). and the lack of testers doesn't help either (which you can agree on general camo).
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #472937 is a reply to message #472925] |
Tue, 07 August 2012 12:57 |
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TheBeerinator
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Registered: November 2010
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| Taz wrote on Tue, 07 August 2012 02:35 |
| One Winged Angel wrote on Mon, 02 July 2012 09:48 |
| Taz wrote on Sun, 01 July 2012 16:01 |
I do, but it's not worth playing anyway. only 3 half-assed maps, nearly all buildings untextured, renegade infantry and a few vehicles.
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| iRANian wrote on Sun, 01 July 2012 17:46 |
not really they look like someone spent 1 minute in ms paint
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I think it's funny how you guys can instantly start with the negative comments concerning a game being developed in this community for free. Some constructive criticism would have been nice, since saying that "it's not worth playing anyway" and saying that the maps are "half-assed" is about as useful to us (the developers) as a sponge made of bricks.
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I don't care whether AR gets released or not... because tbh, even your latest build is half-assed. Like pretty much everything that comes out of BHP's ass these days.
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ITT: shitty failed troll.
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473104 is a reply to message #472937] |
Mon, 13 August 2012 12:16 |
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Taz
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Registered: September 2005
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| TheBeerinator wrote on Tue, 07 August 2012 12:57 |
| Taz wrote on Tue, 07 August 2012 02:35 |
| One Winged Angel wrote on Mon, 02 July 2012 09:48 |
| Taz wrote on Sun, 01 July 2012 16:01 |
I do, but it's not worth playing anyway. only 3 half-assed maps, nearly all buildings untextured, renegade infantry and a few vehicles.
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| iRANian wrote on Sun, 01 July 2012 17:46 |
not really they look like someone spent 1 minute in ms paint
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I think it's funny how you guys can instantly start with the negative comments concerning a game being developed in this community for free. Some constructive criticism would have been nice, since saying that "it's not worth playing anyway" and saying that the maps are "half-assed" is about as useful to us (the developers) as a sponge made of bricks.
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I don't care whether AR gets released or not... because tbh, even your latest build is half-assed. Like pretty much everything that comes out of BHP's ass these days.
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ITT: shitty failed troll.
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I'd call 600 downloads pretty damn succesful tho! 
Even got up a dedicated multiplayer server over at http://vidb.com
[Updated on: Mon, 13 August 2012 12:25] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473130 is a reply to message #473104] |
Wed, 15 August 2012 08:50 |
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OWA
Messages: 647
Registered: May 2006
Location: W3D Hub
Karma: 0
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Colonel |
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| Taz wrote on Mon, 13 August 2012 20:16 |
| TheBeerinator wrote on Tue, 07 August 2012 12:57 |
| Taz wrote on Tue, 07 August 2012 02:35 |
| One Winged Angel wrote on Mon, 02 July 2012 09:48 |
| Taz wrote on Sun, 01 July 2012 16:01 |
I do, but it's not worth playing anyway. only 3 half-assed maps, nearly all buildings untextured, renegade infantry and a few vehicles.
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| iRANian wrote on Sun, 01 July 2012 17:46 |
not really they look like someone spent 1 minute in ms paint
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I think it's funny how you guys can instantly start with the negative comments concerning a game being developed in this community for free. Some constructive criticism would have been nice, since saying that "it's not worth playing anyway" and saying that the maps are "half-assed" is about as useful to us (the developers) as a sponge made of bricks.
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I don't care whether AR gets released or not... because tbh, even your latest build is half-assed. Like pretty much everything that comes out of BHP's ass these days.
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ITT: shitty failed troll.
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I'd call 600 downloads pretty damn succesful tho!
Even got up a dedicated multiplayer server over at www.leekspin.com
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Hello Blackwolf.
I like the fact that you feel you have the justification to call our game half-assed when you yourself left Reborn with most of your work unfinished, before joining the APB team and not finishing any of your work there either. It just proves the fact that you are a massive hypocrite.
Most of us have lives outside of the community, so we simply cannot dedicate all of our time to make the game come out any faster.
Also, well done on your 600 downloads on a game that isn't fun to play. You've got yourself some fine models and animations to look at there, but not much else. It makes me wonder what your motivation is to be honest.
Are you simply that terrible of a person or did one of us say something to hurt your feelings enough that you'd be childish enough to get revenge like this?
Whatever it is, people like you confuse me.
RA2:AR Moddb Page
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473238 is a reply to message #473130] |
Sat, 18 August 2012 05:47 |
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Taz
Messages: 110
Registered: September 2005
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| One Winged Angel wrote on Wed, 15 August 2012 08:50 |
| Taz wrote on Mon, 13 August 2012 20:16 |
| TheBeerinator wrote on Tue, 07 August 2012 12:57 |
| Taz wrote on Tue, 07 August 2012 02:35 |
| One Winged Angel wrote on Mon, 02 July 2012 09:48 |
| Taz wrote on Sun, 01 July 2012 16:01 |
I do, but it's not worth playing anyway. only 3 half-assed maps, nearly all buildings untextured, renegade infantry and a few vehicles.
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| iRANian wrote on Sun, 01 July 2012 17:46 |
not really they look like someone spent 1 minute in ms paint
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I think it's funny how you guys can instantly start with the negative comments concerning a game being developed in this community for free. Some constructive criticism would have been nice, since saying that "it's not worth playing anyway" and saying that the maps are "half-assed" is about as useful to us (the developers) as a sponge made of bricks.
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I don't care whether AR gets released or not... because tbh, even your latest build is half-assed. Like pretty much everything that comes out of BHP's ass these days.
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ITT: shitty failed troll.
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I'd call 600 downloads pretty damn succesful tho!
Even got up a dedicated multiplayer server over at www.leekspin.com
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Hello Blackwolf.
I like the fact that you feel you have the justification to call our game half-assed when you yourself left Reborn with most of your work unfinished, before joining the APB team and not finishing any of your work there either. It just proves the fact that you are a massive hypocrite.
Most of us have lives outside of the community, so we simply cannot dedicate all of our time to make the game come out any faster.
Also, well done on your 600 downloads on a game that isn't fun to play. You've got yourself some fine models and animations to look at there, but not much else. It makes me wonder what your motivation is to be honest.
Are you simply that terrible of a person or did one of us say something to hurt your feelings enough that you'd be childish enough to get revenge like this?
Whatever it is, people like you confuse me.
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Yes, your game is half-assed.
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473248 is a reply to message #469549] |
Sat, 18 August 2012 09:47 |
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Aircraftkiller
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Registered: February 2003
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I'm still not sure why you people insist on calling AR, APB, and Rebarn a game. They're total conversion mods using Renegade's engine. They aren't games in and of themselves without Renegade. They still use Renegade code, Renegade sounds, Renegade assets, etc. They're all Renegade mods.
If they switch to another engine (Unity, Unreal, Crysis) that supports independent game development, then they're a "game dev team".
[Updated on: Sat, 18 August 2012 09:48] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473249 is a reply to message #473248] |
Sat, 18 August 2012 10:52 |
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TheBeerinator
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| Aircraftkiller wrote on Sat, 18 August 2012 09:47 |
I'm still not sure why you people insist on calling AR, APB, and Rebarn a game. They're total conversion mods using Renegade's engine. They aren't games in and of themselves without Renegade. They still use Renegade code, Renegade sounds, Renegade assets, etc. They're all Renegade mods.
If they switch to another engine (Unity, Unreal, Crysis) that supports independent game development, then they're a "game dev team".
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They are all standalone from any sort of renegade installation. That is the main factor in calling them a game.
They use the W3D engine.
When you use one of the engines you mentioned, you are using scripting that utilizes predefined things in the existing engine to extend it. for example: Unrealscript, Unities 3 scripting languages, etc.
Do you know how many custom scripts there are in AR, APB, and Reborn? Lots. They work a lot like any scripting would on any of those engines.
Most games today are "mods" by that logic. Especially with the advent of the big engines.
Didn't you go to school for game design or something?
[Updated on: Sat, 18 August 2012 10:54] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473251 is a reply to message #473248] |
Sat, 18 August 2012 11:01 |
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OWA
Messages: 647
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Colonel |
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| Aircraftkiller wrote on Sat, 18 August 2012 17:47 |
I'm still not sure why you people insist on calling AR, APB, and Rebarn a game. They're total conversion mods using Renegade's engine. They aren't games in and of themselves without Renegade. They still use Renegade code, Renegade sounds, Renegade assets, etc. They're all Renegade mods.
If they switch to another engine (Unity, Unreal, Crysis) that supports independent game development, then they're a "game dev team".
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It does depend how you look at it to be honest. Anything of Renegade's that is left in AR these days is either animations or place-holders.
W3d itself has become a sort of open game development platform since anyone can come and make their own standalone game on it if they really wanted to. It's the same as UDK being a heavily moddable UT3 and Cry-Engine being a heavily moddable Crysis. W3d didn't set out to be an open platform but, in my opinion, it's become this through years of tweaking.
The fact that they don't need Renegade installed to run is another reason why they've been classed as games.
RA2:AR Moddb Page
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473255 is a reply to message #469549] |
Sat, 18 August 2012 12:44 |
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TheBeerinator
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Sure APB uses the executable from Renegade. If one had the complete W3D source code, they would edit the code directly and compile it, which would give them a new executable. Would you call that renegade? No, it's W3D.
Instead we have people like TT, and their scripts to make changes through some horrifying hackery.
Where do you think the executable comes from when you use any other game engine? It is generated for you by the tools supplied by the engine. You just rename it, but underneath it is still Unreal/Unity/whatever.
Now if you want to be a real "game developer", stop pussy footing around with 3rd party engines and make your own. You are just an Uneral total conversion developer. You are just converting a pre-existing engine into your game using the provided tools.
When I think of a mod I think of installing a game, then modifying the files of the game using some other download. APB itself is a single "download and install" just like any other game.
[Updated on: Sat, 18 August 2012 12:46] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473256 is a reply to message #469549] |
Sat, 18 August 2012 12:59 |
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Aircraftkiller
Messages: 8213
Registered: February 2003
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General (5 Stars) |
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The difference being that you're licensed to use other engines. W3D is not licensed to you. You're still not developing a game regardless of how it's attempted to be justified. It's still a total conversion.
APB is a mod like all other TC mods out there. Calling it a game is not going to change what it fundamentally is: a mod, one that still has a ton of Renegade assets inside of it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mod_(video_gaming)
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Most mods do not progress very far and are abandoned without ever having a public release. Some are very limited and just include some gameplay changes or even a different loading screen, and others are total conversions and can modify content and gameplay extensively. A few mods become very popular and convert themselves into distinct games, with the rights getting bought and turning into an official modification.
A group of mod developers may join together to form a mod team. An example is Team Reaction, one of the most prolific mod teams to date, most notably known for QPong and Jailbreak.
Mods are made for many first person shooters and Real-Time-Strategies, most notably the series based on Quake, Doom, Chaos, Total Annihilation, Rise of Nations and the Command & Conquer series also have many mods.
Among popular mods, none is more well known than the Half-Life multiplayer mod Counter-Strike, which was released shortly after the original game, and upwards of 1 million games per day are hosted on dedicated servers. Counter-Strike is probably the best example of a modification that turns into a retail game. Another signature mod is Team Fortress, which was based on the Quake engine and became a whole series of games, such as Team Fortress Classic, Team Fortress 2, and an unofficial mod-made originally as a fan-made sequel to TFC, Fortress Forever.
Mods in general are required to be noncommercial (free) when they include any parts from another mod or the main game, which, by their nature, they always do. Some mods become open source as well.
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[Updated on: Sat, 18 August 2012 13:04] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473257 is a reply to message #473256] |
Sat, 18 August 2012 13:09 |
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TheBeerinator
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| Aircraftkiller wrote on Sat, 18 August 2012 12:59 |
The difference being that you're licensed to use other engines. W3D is not licensed to you. You're still not developing a game regardless of how it's attempted to be justified. It's still a total conversion.
APB is a mod like all other TC mods out there. Calling it a game is not going to change what it fundamentally is: a mod, one that still has a ton of Renegade assets inside of it.
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You are still using assets from those engines. specifically code to run everything. You are still modding assets provided by the engine developers. So until you make everything from scratch I guess you are a total conversion modder with a license to use 3rd party assets.
I am not going to define what a game is based on holding a license, or some arbitrary acceptance of 3rd party assets. Also APB has permission to be standalone. I like to think of that as a license to use the W3D engine, and 3rd party assets in the development of a non-commercial game.
Also that is a terrible wikipedia article. You can't go to wikipedia for something like the definition of when something is considered a game or mod. It's all opinion.
[Updated on: Sat, 18 August 2012 13:13] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473264 is a reply to message #473249] |
Sun, 19 August 2012 02:37 |
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EvilWhiteDragon
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Location: The Netherlands
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General (3 Stars) |
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| TheBeerinator wrote on Sat, 18 August 2012 19:52 |
| Aircraftkiller wrote on Sat, 18 August 2012 09:47 |
I'm still not sure why you people insist on calling AR, APB, and Rebarn a game. They're total conversion mods using Renegade's engine. They aren't games in and of themselves without Renegade. They still use Renegade code, Renegade sounds, Renegade assets, etc. They're all Renegade mods.
If they switch to another engine (Unity, Unreal, Crysis) that supports independent game development, then they're a "game dev team".
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They are all standalone from any sort of renegade installation. That is the main factor in calling them a game.
They use the W3D engine.
When you use one of the engines you mentioned, you are using scripting that utilizes predefined things in the existing engine to extend it. for example: Unrealscript, Unities 3 scripting languages, etc.
Do you know how many custom scripts there are in AR, APB, and Reborn? Lots. They work a lot like any scripting would on any of those engines.
Most games today are "mods" by that logic. Especially with the advent of the big engines.
Didn't you go to school for game design or something?
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You know how much os the gamemechanics is still stock? Lots and lots more. Also, it's not a game since you technically still need a license for the engine.
BlackIntel admin/founder/PR dude (not a coder)
Please visit http://www.blackintel.org/
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People should not be afraid of their governments.
Governments should be afraid of their people.
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473271 is a reply to message #469549] |
Sun, 19 August 2012 08:13 |
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TheBeerinator
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When I think of a mod, I do not think of installing a complete game from a single installer, then playing.
I think of a pre-existing installation being changed with files downloaded.
But hey, you can see the games as whatever you want. I don't really see why it would bother anyone to call them games.
[Updated on: Sun, 19 August 2012 10:00] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Apocalypse Rising released? [message #473311 is a reply to message #473248] |
Mon, 20 August 2012 23:57 |
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Zion
Messages: 2722
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General (2 Stars) |
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| Aircraftkiller wrote on Sat, 18 August 2012 17:47 |
I'm still not sure why you people insist on calling AR, APB, and Rebarn a game. They're total conversion mods using Renegade's engine. They aren't games in and of themselves without Renegade. They still use Renegade code, Renegade sounds, Renegade assets, etc. They're all Renegade mods.
If they switch to another engine (Unity, Unreal, Crysis) that supports independent game development, then they're a "game dev team".
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Chipping in to an old topic that's full of drama and stuffz, but...
By definition, a 'game' is an environment or task which has a set or series of set objectives or goals.
Apocalypse Rising, A Path Beyond, and Rebarn follow these similar rules. They contain a series of maps in which the objective is to destroy the enemy base while protecting your own.
The map you created, (Glacier Flaying) can technically be considered a game, since it has the objective to destroy the enemy base while protecting your own. It cannot however be considered stand alone, since it requires executables and code which require a valid working installation of the base game to play.
Granted that in today's popular terminology, a game can be considered an independent project developed by paid professionals based off an idea. Most of the time, this idea is not original, (CoD series, for example), but some of them are, or enhance other ideas dramatically.
Just because people develop projects in their spare time (Mojang, Relogic, <insert indie development team here>) does not make their project get declassified as a game. If the project has a set of objectives, it is a game.
Using the Unreal, Unity, Cryengine argument is not really valid, and saying that the games using those engines don't use the engine's executable is just incorrect. Granted they may be open source, or require licenses to use, it still uses proprietary code developed by the engine creators in order for individual teams to run their content. If it didn't use the code available to the engine, it couldn't use the engine.
In either case, ApocRising, APB, and Rebarn can be considered their own games, because they utilise a graphics, physics, and data engine to display the materials and resources that they developed individually. They are not allowed to sell their finished products without using their own open source or licensed engine or without written expressed permission from the current engine owner. They are however considered stand alone, due to not requiring any prerequisite content based around the engine or game that uses the engine. Content previously used for the purchasable game that provides the engine their game is based on comes with the installers for the three games (The exact same can be said for Unity, Unreal, etc. I can imagine the other games developed on those use sound/anim/texture/model assets from the games they were developed from).
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