Home » General Discussions » Heated Discussions and Debates » prop 8 california passes
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #358254 is a reply to message #358213] |
Wed, 12 November 2008 05:22   |
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Spoony
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Registered: January 2006
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General (3 Stars)
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| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
I have no problem with gays and their lifestyle. But gay marriage is not just an issue that affects only gays. It asks cooperation from the majority by urging them to change their value system.
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No, it doesn't. It DOES NOT, repeat DOES NOT, affect you no matter how determined some people are to wish it did. You do not have to change your value system.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
The reason? Not that the majority is being oppressive. It's far from that. I don't think it is appropriate to suggest that this is a case where a certain majority is oppressing the minority. It is also not too fair to suggest that this issue is comparable to the issue of women voters and Blacks.
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Women perhaps; you're dead wrong to say it's not comparable to racial intolerance. The reason your country is so backward in the field of equal rights on sexuality is pretty much exactly the same reason it took you so fucking disgracefully long to get equal rights on grounds of race. Namely religion.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
This issue goes right into the fundamental concept of human life for the past thousands of years.
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Rhetoric.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
Given the huge numbers of the general religious population in the US, it would be an uphill struggle for homosexuals to gain "acceptance" by a group of people who have an entirely different value system. While it may seem that this majority is trying to preserve the integrity of their value system by denying others their right to practice their own, so small and tightly packed is the society that the change demanded is too great and fundamental that they simply cannot cooperate.
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What do you mean "while it may seem..."? It doesn't need to seem like that; it is PRECISELY that.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
If you think this is the majority oppressing a minority, I would say it is merely a false illusion. It is more the case of the majority reacting to the threat of eventual subjugation by a minority in the near future.
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As opposed to the subjugation that religion has imposed upon pretty much every society throughout history wherever and whenever it has the strength to be able to?
Including your country right now?
That is real subjugation. "Eventual subjugation" by a homosexual minority? You're crazy.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
Christian parents want to impart Christian values to their kids. This applies to people of all faiths.
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Yep, and the irony is the people who do this immoral action (indoctrination of children) are always the same dipshits who keep whining about homosexuality on "moral" grounds, even though there has never, ever been a convincing moral argument against homosexuality. It'd be funny if it wasn't so sad.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
When in the future (if gay marriages are "legalized"), their kid asks them why one of his friends has 2 dads or 2 moms, what the heck are they going to say? You have got to be quite bigoted and indifferent if you do not see the conflict of ideals there.
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As opposed to someone asking me why my parents think the world was made in a week by a celestial superbeing 6000 years ago? I personally think it would be far less embarrassing to have two dads.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
Saying "boooo religion" is not a good approach to solve the problem.
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It's a good start, since religion is once again standing firmly in the way of progress.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
Sure it is inferred but they do not want to impose anything...they just will not cooperate with gay marriage and amend their lifestyle to accept it because it severely compromises their value system.
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I'll just repeat the fact that it does not "compromise" your value system, no matter how hard you have convinced yourself it does. You do not even have to "accept" it if you want...
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
I probably won't cooperate either. I could care less if you lived right next to my house and played with a dick the night before but then when you bring your kid along with his other dad to the bustop in the morning, I don't want to be anywhere nearby with MY kid.
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I hear you, I don't particularly want to be around intolerant religious nutcases either; difference is you don't see me saying that it "compromises my value system" when a Christian walks past.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
I know you would say I am a "blowhard" and "intolerant" but then again, I believe in my Creator and the rules set forth.
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You stone people to death for working on the Sabbath?
You think envy belongs in the 10 Commandments shortlist, but rape and slavery and cruelty to children don't?
You think someone can be punished for a crime committed by someone else?
You think the path to forgiveness is the torture and execution of someone else?
This is what your Bible says. I would go so far as to call these things morally despicable, and yet the same people who get their "morals" from such a nightmarish book love to rant about homosexuality on "moral" grounds (as if there has ever been a convincing moral argument against homosexuality... which there hasn't). Oh, the irony... I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
I could give a thousand more examples where the conflict of ideals would come up.
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What do you mean "more"? You haven't given one yet.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
Not a women voter issue, not anywhere close to being close to the racism suffered by Blacks, this is something deep but I think this issue will be resolved like the above issues in the decades to come as the religious population wears thin with each incoming generation and the liberal trend continues to spiral upwards.
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We can only hope. America finally got something approaching equality on racial grounds despite religion's best efforts to the contrary; perhaps equality on sexual grounds will be next, but once again, religion is the only real impediment to sensible morality.
| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:09 |
In an era where the terms "homophobe" and "homohpobia" is freely and unjustly and stupidly applied to anyone who is not pro-homosexuality without respect to their values and religion, expect more opposition as you try to forcibly change the value system of the majority.
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Again, I can only repeat the fact that your "value system" is NOT BEING FORCIBLY CHANGED. You're going to have to get your head around this.
Unleash the Renerageâ„¢
Renedrama [ren-i-drah-muh]
- noun
1. the inevitable criticism one receives after doing something awful
[Updated on: Wed, 12 November 2008 05:57] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #358257 is a reply to message #358256] |
Wed, 12 November 2008 05:46 |
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Spoony
Messages: 3915
Registered: January 2006
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General (3 Stars)
Tactics & Strategies Moderator |
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*shrug* I retired a while ago
Unleash the Renerageâ„¢
Renedrama [ren-i-drah-muh]
- noun
1. the inevitable criticism one receives after doing something awful
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #358266 is a reply to message #357476] |
Wed, 12 November 2008 07:59 |
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NukeIt15
Messages: 987
Registered: February 2003
Location: Out to lunch
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Colonel |
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I was going to write another rant out, but I actually think I can slim it down this time.
| What pawkyfox *really* said: |
I am incapable of explaining anything that doesn't fit into my limited worldview. I want the government to make gays not be gay in public because they'll make my kids ask questions that make my brain hurt. If they're allowed to get married, I might actually have to question my beliefs, I'm scared shitless that some of them might actually change if I think about them too much! Can't anyone see how selfish gays are? I'm being oppressed here!
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I'm with Spoony on this one- I don't know whether I should be laughing or crying.
"Arms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. Horrid mischief would ensue were (the law-abiding) deprived of the use of them." - Thomas Paine
Remember, kids: illiteracy is cool. If you took the time to read this, you are clearly a loser who will never get laid. You've been warned.
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #358288 is a reply to message #358283] |
Wed, 12 November 2008 10:04 |
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| Jerad Gray wrote on Wed, 12 November 2008 11:26 |
| cheesesoda wrote on Tue, 11 November 2008 21:47 |
Compromising their value system? I haven't had to compromise any of my values since I became a libertarian. I don't need society to follow my views for me to live my life the way I see fit.
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If your a libertarian you should have known that society wouldn't follow your views, as it is always society's goal to put limits on everything...
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Oh, I know this, but that doesn't make me feel/vote any different.
Libertarian Party | The King's Throne | The Soda Shop
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #359142 is a reply to message #359124] |
Thu, 20 November 2008 13:56 |
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Ma1kel
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Location: Kingdom of the Netherland...
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| renalpha wrote on Thu, 20 November 2008 15:05 |
lmfao most of you are seriously fucked up in their faces.
So faggots are disgusting? however I can handle it, I am not a fag but I don't hate, or find them disgusting. its just something I don't need to see and they just don't have to confront it with me.
But why FFS WHY, are you hating on them, we love lesbians right?
So why bother hate on man fags? Seriously, come up with something good an proper. Because I know all man love lesbian girls who rub pussy's when their between 18 and 27. So please PLEASE, come with something good or just die or something.. Geezz, fkn moreones.
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Nice bigotry against asexuals there, mate. I feel offended.
Dutch to English
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #359256 is a reply to message #359124] |
Fri, 21 November 2008 08:38 |
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GEORGE ZIMMER
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Registered: March 2006
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General (2 Stars) |
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| renalpha wrote on Thu, 20 November 2008 13:05 |
lmfao most of you are seriously fucked up in their faces.
So faggots are disgusting? however I can handle it, I am not a fag but I don't hate, or find them disgusting. its just something I don't need to see and they just don't have to confront it with me.
But why FFS WHY, are you hating on them, we love lesbians right?
So why bother hate on man fags? Seriously, come up with something good an proper. Because I know all man love lesbian girls who rub pussy's when their between 18 and 27. So please PLEASE, come with something good or just die or something.. Geezz, fkn moreones.
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Shut the fuck up and stop being stupid. If you actually READ this thread for once, there's a difference between hatred and personally not wanting to be something because you personally find it disgusting.
Toggle Spoiler| Scrin wrote on Sat, 24 January 2009 13:22 |
| cAmpa wrote on Sat, 24 January 2009 12:45 |
Scrin, stop pming people to get the building bars.
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FUCK YOU AND THIS SHIT GAME WITH YOUR SCRIPTS!!! I HAVE ASKING YOU AND ANOTHER NOOBS HERE ABOUT HELP WITH THAT BUILDING ICONS FEATURES FOR YEARS, BUT YOU KEEP IGNORING ME AND KEEP WRITE SHIT, SO BURN YOU AND YOUR ASSLICKERS FRIENDS, THIS TIME I'M NOT COME BACK!!!!!!!!!   
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #359315 is a reply to message #359279] |
Fri, 21 November 2008 15:46 |
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u6795
Messages: 1261
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Location: Maryland
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General (1 Star) |
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| renalpha wrote on Fri, 21 November 2008 13:29 |
your an dipstick nub.
you guys were talking about its good that they are not allowed to marrie. grow up and take a look at the real deal.
the faggots are offended by this because it makes no sence at all.
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Be specific when you say you guys. Also nice, you say gays should have the same rights and you call them faggots later.
To make things clear again since I still think people don't understand me: I support gays and think they should have all the rights that normal couples have. I have gay friends and all of them are extremely nice people. My only problem is I, being a hetero male, think being homosexual is nasty. I don't let that opinion influence my actions or relationships with them in the slightest.
Anyways, I'm going to stay out of this thread now, it's way too retarded for me to handle due to Renalpha shitting it up after Spoony's awesome posts.
yeah
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #359824 is a reply to message #359814] |
Tue, 25 November 2008 08:57 |
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| pawkyfox wrote on Tue, 25 November 2008 08:55 |
I will get back to this thread later today.
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Don't bother. You're a self-righteous asshole who has absolutely no solid ground to stand on. You hide behind religion and a pseudo-standard "family formula" that has not existed for as long as people try to claim. It's always changing, and it always has been.
As far as this debate goes, God and the Bible are irrelevant. I would argue that God and the Bible is irrelevant in the world period, but that's a different argument for a different day.
Just about everything in the world compromises someone else's values. We eat cows, that's morally wrong in Hinduism. Some cultures eat dogs, horses, and cats. We see this as mainly morally wrong and disgusting. Many people think alcohol consumption is immoral and seeing someone drunk makes them uncomfortable. The same goes for smoking. Sex, although natural, and we all were created out of the act (except for many a rare exception with artificial insemination), many people are ashamed of the act and are absolutely repulsed by the idea of prostitution. Yet, at one point, the Catholic church used to make money off of prostitution and condoned it as a "necessary evil".
While I certainly have intolerance for a lot of lifestyles and acts, I recognize that as long as no unwilling participant is being harmed in the act or lifestyle, it shouldn't be prohibited. Otherwise, you're just catering to a bunch of egotistical, self-important assholes who seem to claim moral supremacy and take it upon themselves to guide the blind. Guess what, morons? You're just as fucking blind as the rest of us. However, you're too god damn ignorant to realize it because you suck on the teet of some imaginary being and it's "book of wisdom" that was written by man several thousand years ago. Tell me, who are the ones that are truly lost? Because, to me, it's starting to look like it's you.
Libertarian Party | The King's Throne | The Soda Shop
[Updated on: Tue, 25 November 2008 08:58] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #359939 is a reply to message #359124] |
Tue, 25 November 2008 20:49 |
Berkut
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| renalpha wrote on Thu, 20 November 2008 13:05 |
Because I know all man love lesbian girls who rub pussy's when their between 18 and 27.
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:counter-example:
It's like going to the Consumer Electronics Showcase with your check-book. What's the point?
[Updated on: Tue, 25 November 2008 20:51] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: prop 8 california passes [message #368772 is a reply to message #357598] |
Sat, 24 January 2009 13:38 |
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slosha
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you know whatever, if they wanna get married and do what they do want then whatever... it's not really that big of a deal.. but i do think stuff like that should stay between a man and a women.. but gays will do it reguardless, so why worry about it?
| Ryu wrote on Thu, 06 November 2008 19:04 |
Great, next Gay sex will be banned, great porn studios in LA and CA will not produce gay porn and then we will lose 95% of all great lesbian porn, and women will be objectified in porn by having ass sex for money! 
THANKS, CALIFORNIA, YOU RUINED PORN FOR US!
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this is the AMERICA not england -.-
The road I cruise is a bitch now, baby.
[Updated on: Sat, 24 January 2009 14:05] Report message to a moderator |
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