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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #321821 is a reply to message #321668] |
Wed, 12 March 2008 07:41   |
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Starbuzz
Messages: 2487
Registered: May 2007
Karma: 2
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General (2 Stars) |
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| warranto wrote on Tue, 11 March 2008 11:19 |
Heh, I have to admit I don't take these "attacks" on Christianity to be threatening in any way.
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When did you start branding logical reasoning as "attacks"? It's the usual ignorance I have come to expect.
| warranto wrote on Tue, 11 March 2008 11:19 |
However, with that being said, Religion and God have, in essence, absolutely nothing to do with each other. To prove religion wrong in no way affects the idea of there being a God, only that one way of understanding him was incorrect.
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Sure, how can a hypothetical be disproven?
[Updated on: Wed, 12 March 2008 10:39] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #321846 is a reply to message #321845] |
Wed, 12 March 2008 11:40 |
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Starbuzz
Messages: 2487
Registered: May 2007
Karma: 2
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General (2 Stars) |
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| warranto wrote on Wed, 12 March 2008 12:37 |
ermm.. huh?
Sorry, I figured that with "attacks" being in quotation marks, it would be seen as using the word as OTHERS have used them, not myself.
I didn't realize it would be seen as me quoting myself in my own post through the use of quotation marks to indicate me quoting myself in my own post... "perhaps when I make comments in my own post I should start doing this?"
"It seems kind of redundant, no?"
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No BS please.
| warranto wrote on Wed, 12 March 2008 12:37 |
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Sure, how can a hypothetical be disproven?
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Sorry... but what does this have to do with disproving a hypothetical?
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ooo missed a word...meant hypothetical being.
[Updated on: Wed, 12 March 2008 11:43] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #321861 is a reply to message #321852] |
Wed, 12 March 2008 12:44 |
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Starbuzz
Messages: 2487
Registered: May 2007
Karma: 2
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General (2 Stars) |
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| warranto wrote on Wed, 12 March 2008 13:08 |
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It shows you are ignoring the thousands of other gods that people felt secure with since human beings appeared on the Earth. And the only reason you are not worshipping another god was because of the random way you were born into a family with a certain religious affilation. This applies for everyone.
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Point being?
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Point being you are just a tool in the endless cycle of humanity.
| warranto wrote on Wed, 12 March 2008 13:08 |
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Oh like blind faith as religious folks?
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You don't have to possess blind faith to be religious...
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Yeah, you can also attribute all the good things that happen to you as the work of a god. 
| warranto wrote on Wed, 12 March 2008 13:08 |
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There are plenty of solid evidence which makes you think harder about the issue.
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I'd love to see this evidence.
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Visit your local library and start with a book on Natural History. The moment you abandon that attitude of yours is the moment you break free of the impressions your parents made on you since childhood.
[Updated on: Wed, 12 March 2008 12:53] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #323232 is a reply to message #323216] |
Fri, 21 March 2008 14:14 |
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Starbuzz
Messages: 2487
Registered: May 2007
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Funny how warranto assumes I am out of an answer so that's why I did not respond! haha! I was actually doing Xtians a big favor by not critically questioning your beliefs but I guess Holy Week has rekindled some spiritual flames. hahah!
SOOOO, don't blame me when things go a bit out of control from now on. warranto started it. But I will try to keep it "civil."
| warranto wrote on Wed, 12 March 2008 14:28 |
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Point being you are just a tool in the endless cycle of humanity.
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Explain. How is talking about the existence of a God different than talking about the existence of a God?
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It's obvious I was referring to our real life personalities and the life we are leading outside these electronic forum pages.
| warranto wrote on Wed, 12 March 2008 14:28 |
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Yeah, you can also attribute all the good things that happen to you as the work of a god.
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I'm lost... what does this claim have to do with my argument?
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Well, you said:
| warranto wrote on Wed, 12 March 2008 13:08 |
You don't have to possess blind faith to be religious...
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And I felt it was safe to assume what I just mentioned above.
| warranto wrote on Wed, 12 March 2008 14:28 |
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Visit your local library and start with a book on Natural History. The moment you abandon that attitude of yours is the moment you break free of the impressions your parents made on you since childhood.
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Considering I have yet to state what my "attitude" is, I'm surprised you can make this claim...
what does a book on Natural History have to do with anything that I've said?
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You don't have to "state" your attitude.
Many "different" schools of thoughts are there that makes you question the Bible. If you think I just "jumped on the Atheist bandwagon" as a rebellious teen, you would be very wrong. My decision (that I struggled with for 2 years) was based on the scientific findings of thousands of intelligent men and women WAY intelligent.
I am not saying they have all the answers but in no way are they as confused as you. The bloodshed, curses, torments, punishments, and the other narrow ramblings of the Jewish literature that is otherwise know as the Bible pales like shit in comparision.
So, before trying to make a smart "I would like to see that evidence" comment, it will make sense to read some of their works to gain a better understanding of the world you live in. All the answers are not in one book (that was written in a primitive age). 
[Updated on: Fri, 21 March 2008 16:02] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #323270 is a reply to message #314167] |
Fri, 21 March 2008 17:54 |
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warranto
Messages: 2584
Registered: February 2003
Location: Alberta, Canada
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General (2 Stars) |
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Sigh...
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Funny how warranto assumes I am out of an answer so that's why I did not respond! haha!
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It would be, if only you could show me where I said that?
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It's obvious I was referring to our real life personalities and the life we are leading outside these electronic forum pages.
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That's nice. Still doesn't answer my question. I bring in a question about God, you ask why I'm not using "god", and in the process say that I am a tool.
Again, answer the question that was asked. How is talking about the existence of a God different than talking about the existence of a God?
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And I felt it was safe to assume what I just mentioned above.
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Inferencing something that was never said as an argument only to attack it does not work in any form of "logic", sorry. That would be the same as me asking "What's 2+2", and you answering "5! Oh, I thought you were inferring +1 added to that statement!"
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So, before trying to make a smart "I would like to see that evidence" comment, it will make sense to read some of their works to gain a better understanding of the world you live in. All the answers are not in one book (that was written in a primitive age).
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Sorry, but I fail to see how reading a book on natural history disproves God's existence. I'm also curious as to why you assume I get all my answers from one book? I never stated that anywhere. (Remember what I said about inferring answers?)
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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #323272 is a reply to message #323270] |
Fri, 21 March 2008 18:08 |
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Starbuzz
Messages: 2487
Registered: May 2007
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If you re-read, your question does not make sense AT ALL. Like some odd one thrown into the mix?
Also, I am not trying to disprove "God's" existence! Wow wow...now I see why you (and your types) are misunderstanding all this. I am saying there is a lot more than you could even imagine...a lot more than what error-filled Jewish literature has led many to believe.
EDIT:
This is what scientists are working on. It may take hundreds and hundreds of years to figure this out. And I think it is definitely possible. Consider how long it took for humans to find that out, contrary to popular (and biblical) beliefs, that the Sun was in the center and not the Earth.
So in this state of uncertaintly, I am not gonna come to any premature conclusions (that are presented as the truth in a global scale) that has gaping holes in context with simple logic.
[Updated on: Fri, 21 March 2008 18:24] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #323276 is a reply to message #323272] |
Fri, 21 March 2008 18:21 |
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warranto
Messages: 2584
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Location: Alberta, Canada
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| Starbuzz wrote on Fri, 21 March 2008 18:08 |
Also, if you re-read, your question does not make senese AT ALL. Like some odd one thrown into the mix?
I am not trying to disprove "God's" existence! Wow wow...now I see why you are misunderstanding all this. I am saying there is a lot more than you could even imagine...a lot more than what error-filled Jewish literature has led many to believe.
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Edit was after I started posting, so I'll address it here.
The question makes sense if you read back to what you said.
You got after me for using "God", and called me a tool when I said it wasn't a big deal. So I ask "How is talking about the existence of a God different than talking about the existence of a God?" because, according to you, I am a tool for talking about the existence of a God (be it "God", "god", "Bob", or whatever name you give a divine being).
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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #323278 is a reply to message #323276] |
Fri, 21 March 2008 18:38 |
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Starbuzz
Messages: 2487
Registered: May 2007
Karma: 2
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General (2 Stars) |
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I edited my post above.
| warranto wrote on Fri, 21 March 2008 19:17 |
Well, when you said:
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I didn't choose to believe a god does not exist. There are plenty of solid evidence which makes you think harder about the issue.
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It suggested that you "came about" the idea that a god does not exist from <whatever means>, so I ask for this "evidence" that God does not exist.
You proceed to insult me and then tell me to read the book natural history as this "evidence".
I tell you it is not evidence, only to have you insult me again.
Hmm.. I could only wonder where any sort of misunderstanding occurred. The fact you said you could provide evidence of God not existing, or the fact you insult me when I said God's existence could not be proven or disproven.
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You shouln't be assuming no?
I honestly meant there are other possibilities and that nothign is cut out.
"Thinking harder" was me for 2 years trying to grasp the fact and doubting slowly (and sometimes fearfully) that the Bible may not be the expert on things as it is presented as. It was only a natural process and not based on any arrogance as others have suggested...I doubted the Bible, there was too little faith to stop my intellectual reasoning and curiosity, and boom, next thing I know, I felt like talking to myself when saying a prayer.
And you assumed something about that statement that was incorrect and hence the misunderstanding.
And you asked for evidence just like that and I told you furiously to go read some books.
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As for me calling you a tool, well, not because you talked about "God," because you have come to a rigid conclusion on something we humans are still in the process of discovery. And you have based it on error-filled literature. Doesn't make sense at all.
[Updated on: Fri, 21 March 2008 18:44] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #323283 is a reply to message #314167] |
Fri, 21 March 2008 19:05 |
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warranto
Messages: 2584
Registered: February 2003
Location: Alberta, Canada
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General (2 Stars) |
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I asked nothing about the bible. I asked on this evidence you had on God's non-existance (considering that's what were were talking about, and NOT the bible, I figured you would be providing evidence on God, not the bible)
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You shouln't be assuming no?
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Not assuming there. I was interpreting what you said by using basic grammar rules. (And people wonder why grammar on the Internet is a good thing...)
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"Thinking harder" was me for 2 years trying to grasp the fact and doubting slowly (and sometimes fearfully) that the Bible may not be the expert on things as it is presented as. It was only a natural process and not based on any arrogance as others have suggested...I doubted the Bible, there was too little faith to stop my intellectual reasoning and curiosity, and boom, next thing I know, I felt like talking to myself when saying a prayer.
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Again, your lack of trust in the bible does nothing to answer any of my questions, or even touch on what we were discussing.
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As for me calling you a tool, well, not because you talked about "God," because you have come to a rigid conclusion on something we humans are still in the process of discovery. And you have based it on error-filled literature. Doesn't make sense at all.
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Show me where I have come to a "rigid" conclusion by saying there is no proof to support or deny God's existence. Show me where I said I based my uncertainty on ANY literature.
You pulling these arguments out of thin air is what doesn't make any sense at all. NOWHERE have I stated ANYTHING you have been suggesting.
This "You're wrong because I'm making up faulty arguments for you" thing you seem to thoroughly enjoy doesn't quite work if you want to make any sort of valid argument, or even just to be taken seriously.
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| Re: question to christians about jesus [message #323298 is a reply to message #323283] |
Sat, 22 March 2008 02:04 |
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Starbuzz
Messages: 2487
Registered: May 2007
Karma: 2
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| warranto wrote on Fri, 21 March 2008 20:05 |
I asked nothing about the bible. I asked on this evidence you had on God's non-existance (considering that's what were were talking about, and NOT the bible, I figured you would be providing evidence on God, not the bible)
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Yes, you keep asking for the impossible and seem to enjoy that.
In addition to human discoveries, the Bible itself is the source of it's own demise thanks to it's huge errors.
It does not matter if it is God or the Bible...both are the same. This is your faulty logic I have been trying to point out. Unlike other religions, in Christianity, you cannot escape with trying to seperate the Bible and God. Both are the same as the Bible is "God's Word" and the Bible is an insight into God.
There is a reason that book is known as the "Holy Bible."
Rather than argue that, you keep asking for evidence on God (you enjoy that don't you?). The point of the whole thread is the validity of a mystical man who lived some 2000 years ago and some error-filled texts.
See, your whole useless arguments and your questions are all begging me for evidence! You keep basing your argument on the fact that I have this "evidence" and that I am obliged to provide it. My "evidence" is to have a open mind and look at other theories to our existence that explain things way better.
There are other theories that give a much more broader and logical view than the one that claims everything was spoken into existence.
| warranto wrote on Fri, 21 March 2008 20:05 |
Show me where I have come to a "rigid" conclusion by saying there is no proof to support or deny God's existence.
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You simply came to a conclusion about "God" that's all. You never said anything about proof.
| warranto wrote on Tue, 11 March 2008 11:19 |
However, with that being said, Religion and God have, in essence, absolutely nothing to do with each other. To prove religion wrong in no way affects the idea of there being a God, only that one way of understanding him was incorrect.
If you are going to attempt to prove that God doesn't exist, you won't do it by proving any sort of Religion to be wrong.
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Looks pretty rigid to me. You seem to imply that even if religious practices/religious texts were proven false, there would always be "God."
That is the whole point of the argument you enjoy missing out. As I mentioned above, the validity of "God", the god with the capital G, is DIRECTLY tied to the error-filled texts known as the Bible. If it weren't for the Bible, "God" would not be so famous. Some other higher being to explain everything would be.
| warranto wrote on Fri, 21 March 2008 20:05 |
You pulling these arguments out of thin air is what doesn't make any sense at all. NOWHERE have I stated ANYTHING you have been suggesting.
This "You're wrong because I'm making up faulty arguments for you" thing you seem to thoroughly enjoy doesn't quite work if you want to make any sort of valid argument, or even just to be taken seriously.
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It is you who likes to drag the conversion to COMPLETELY useless areas of discussion.
What you have done so far is what typical Christians who defend their faith do: spin it. Let's cut to the crap shall we?
[Updated on: Sat, 22 March 2008 02:16] Report message to a moderator |
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