Home » General Discussions » Heated Discussions and Debates » hope none of you are them
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209302 is a reply to message #207824] |
Sat, 22 July 2006 18:00   |
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glyde51
Messages: 1827
Registered: August 2004
Location: Winnipeg
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General (1 Star) |
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| Torn wrote on Thu, 13 July 2006 02:23 |
ar ther any relligiss peple on this form that think if you share diffrent beleifs or r cathlic than them YOU will burn in hell???
just askin becus acording to my frend im not cathlik so im going to hell
thees peple think were bad.....
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I'm an Athiest myself, but I suppose I have to respect others opinions, though I believe it was rather rude of your friend to tell you that "you are going to Hell."
No. Seriously. No.
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209334 is a reply to message #207824] |
Sun, 23 July 2006 00:25 |
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Scythar
Messages: 580
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Location: Finland
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Our body decomposes, the bones being the last thing left of us, but in time even they turn to dust. Or if you're talking about a spirit of some kind, an atheist wouldn't probably believe in such a thing anyway. We're just very complicated machines, and that area in science is advancing pretty fast too. We already have quite a lot of evidence that we don't even have a freedom of choice, it's just an illusion. Did you know that your brain knows what you're going to do before you acknowledge it? For example, if you have a button in front of you and you're to press it anytime, your brain starts the action almost 500 milliseconds before you "decide" to press it. Sure, there's a lot of room for speculation and I'm not a neurologist, but I'm just trying to make a point: there is still no evidence of any divine spirit that lies in us, and from the atheists point of view there's no reason to believe in one. Just my 20 cents, even if I'm more of an agnostic than atheist.
EDIT: This was just posted on Slashdot:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/07/060721182137.ht m
There's a hole in the sky through which things can fly.
[Updated on: Sun, 23 July 2006 00:38] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209362 is a reply to message #209334] |
Sun, 23 July 2006 10:34 |
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IronWarrior
Messages: 2460
Registered: November 2004
Location: England UK
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General (2 Stars) |
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| Scythar wrote on Sun, 23 July 2006 09:25 |
Our body decomposes, the bones being the last thing left of us, but in time even they turn to dust. Or if you're talking about a spirit of some kind, an atheist wouldn't probably believe in such a thing anyway. We're just very complicated machines, and that area in science is advancing pretty fast too. We already have quite a lot of evidence that we don't even have a freedom of choice, it's just an illusion. Did you know that your brain knows what you're going to do before you acknowledge it? For example, if you have a button in front of you and you're to press it anytime, your brain starts the action almost 500 milliseconds before you "decide" to press it. Sure, there's a lot of room for speculation and I'm not a neurologist, but I'm just trying to make a point: there is still no evidence of any divine spirit that lies in us, and from the atheists point of view there's no reason to believe in one. Just my 20 cents, even if I'm more of an agnostic than atheist.
EDIT: This was just posted on Slashdot:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/07/060721182137.ht m
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Well thats just commen sense, thats how our bodys work.. its like moving from A to B, you dont think about moving your legs and walking there, you just do it.
Am agnostic, I think we have some spirit or life force that will be reborn into a new life when we die.
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209394 is a reply to message #207841] |
Sun, 23 July 2006 14:23 |
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reborn
Messages: 3231
Registered: September 2004
Location: uk - london
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General (3 Stars) |
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| Mad Ivan wrote on Thu, 13 July 2006 07:22 |
Like idjit, i am an atheist. I believe in no gods
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Atheism by definition is the lack of theism. It makes me laugh that you believe there are no Gods, rather than you do not believe in God.
I was in an interesting debate recently with someone who also said they believe that God does not exist, and I pointed out that that remark in itself demonstrates a belief, so therefore they are not an atheist. One could also argue that the belief that God does not exist is a religion in itself.
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209439 is a reply to message #209406] |
Sun, 23 July 2006 17:56 |
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reborn
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| mrpirate wrote on Sun, 23 July 2006 18:21 |
Being an atheist doesn't mean that you're not allowed to believe in anything, it means that you don't believe in a God or gods. Believing there is no god means the same thing as disbelieving in god.
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Atheism, in its broadest sense, is the absence of theism. - sourced from wikipedia
He has stated that he believes there are no Gods, which means he is acting on faith.
There is a difference between "believing there are no Gods" and "not believing there are Gods".
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209450 is a reply to message #208882] |
Sun, 23 July 2006 19:56 |
KIRBY-098
Messages: 338
Registered: July 2006
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Recruit |
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| Javaxcx wrote on Wed, 19 July 2006 16:40 |
Despite being quiet in this thread as to see where it goes, I'm hoping to get a reasoned and well thought out response from you in regrards to the question I'm going to ask.
Why is this truth? Why is *insert non-biblical doctrine* not truth? Is there a rational non-circular argument to support the objectivity of the Bible? If so, I would truly like to hear it.
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http://answering-islam.org/Case/index.html
Sorry to throw a website at you java. I hate doing that, but I face serious time constraints ATM. I prefer a more personal and less wordy version, but this answers what I think you're asking.
Right now, i'm trying to raise three kids, keep marital bliss, serve in the local congregation and study for an upcoming entrance math exam for the school I just sold my house, and quit my job to attend.
(If any of you have heard of fullsail, you know what I'm up against)
If you have further questions on the authenticity of the bible, let me know.
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209470 is a reply to message #207824] |
Sun, 23 July 2006 23:38 |
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Hydra
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Location: Atlanta, GA
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WAY TO QUOTE OUT OF CONTEXT.
| Quote: |
Introduction
In this series of newsletters I am seeking to set forth the case for Christianity. In Part 1 of this series I laid out the argument for the reasonableness of our faith. The argument consists of three premises:
1.The Bible is a basically reliable and trustworthy document of history.
2.On the basis of this we have sufficient evidence to believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
3.Jesus Christ teaches that the Bible is the very Word of God.
Conclusion: Since the Bible is the Word of God, then Christianity is true.
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That was a summary of a certain newsletter. Obviously, if you wanted to read the support for those claims, you would have to read the newsletter.
Those three points were not the author's the evidence but rather an overview of what he already wrote.
Why couldn't we say the very same thing about every single scientific text that has been published since Aristotle?
P.S. Crimson, I'm curious as to what you read that brought you to your current state of thinking; did you mix in some religious texts with your atheistic reading, or did you just stick with documents that "disproved" the existence of God?
Walter Keith Koester: September 22, 1962 - March 15, 2005
God be with you, Uncle Wally.
 (<---New(ish) Prayer Group Forums)
 (<---Archived Prayer Group Forums)
[Updated on: Sun, 23 July 2006 23:41] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209486 is a reply to message #207824] |
Mon, 24 July 2006 02:06 |
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Crimson
Messages: 7427
Registered: February 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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General (5 Stars)
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I don't always tend to read other people's thoughts and recycle them as my own. I've thought the whole "god" thing was ridiculous as long as I can remember. Reading what other people say on atheist-oriented sites just helps put my thoughts into words. Heck, I came up with the theory of quantum immortality when I was in 4th grade (or earlier)... reading about it just let me put my thoughts into words.
In fact, if I really think back, my dad was an atheist (he's not anymore). He had some atheist group's newsletter at his house and I found it and read it. I don't remember the contents of the newsletter but I remember that it was the first time I learned that there were people who didn't believe in "God". I would guess that not only as a result of very little church exposure, combined with this... as long as I can remember, this whole "God" thing didn't sit well with me. I put that story on the same level as Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy. Learning that there existed people who didn't believe put it in some sort of perspective for me and I haven't believed since. Not even for a moment. At this time I was most likely in 5th or 6th grade.
Just to clarify... this newsletter really just put a name and an identity to how I felt. Just like I didn't know my youthful "infinite dimensions" theory was called "quantum immortality" in scientific circles. I suppose there was a time when I took the alleged existence of "God" at face value but seeing how weird people acted in church and the whole concept of talking to someone you can't see was just the start of the path I am on.
I'm the bawss.
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209491 is a reply to message #209448] |
Mon, 24 July 2006 03:47 |
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reborn
Messages: 3231
Registered: September 2004
Location: uk - london
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General (3 Stars) |
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| mrpirate wrote on Sun, 23 July 2006 21:46 |
The statements "believe in no god" and "do not believe in god" seem to logically imply each other, to me. Further, theism is defined as the belief in a god or gods, so, naturally, atheism is not believing in a god or gods. I don't know why you think that atheism implies having no beliefs whatsoever.
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The fact that he believes no God exists means he is acting on faith.
If he simply "did not believe in any Gods", then it would of meant he had a lack of faith in the their existance.
The difference is subtle, but quite important. There is a big difference between positively believing that a thing does not exist, and simply lacking belief in it's existence.
Because I am saying he is acting on faith, I am saying he has a religion, he has positive belief in the non-existence of God. I am implying he is a theist at heart, not that atheism means having no beliefs.
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209493 is a reply to message #207824] |
Mon, 24 July 2006 04:00 |
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Scythar
Messages: 580
Registered: February 2003
Location: Finland
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Looks like just a problem with grammar to me, just like many have troubles understanding the difference between "God" and "god". Nevertheless, whether a person believes in something or not doesn't have anything to do with how good he is at english.
There's a hole in the sky through which things can fly.
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209497 is a reply to message #207824] |
Mon, 24 July 2006 05:03 |
KIRBY-098
Messages: 338
Registered: July 2006
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Recruit |
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So you read one paragraph of a four part series on the authenticity of the bible, and it's secular supports for existence and validity and you think you're an expert on the subject matter.
There is no shortcut to studying this topic children. If you don't want to take time to properly research the topic to provide a reasonable, and respectful answer then stay out of discussions on serious theological discourse.
This site is just adressing how a secular mind can start to see why christians consider the bible inerrant.
There are real and quantifiable supports in the non-christian world for the things that DID happen in history.
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209517 is a reply to message #207824] |
Mon, 24 July 2006 08:18 |
mision08
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Colonel |
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The Bible is not a story written by Harry Potter. It is a compilation of books written by many people. Disciples of Jesus Christ, who "did a lot" for people 2000 years ago. Mathew, Mark, Luke and John The Baptist each wrote a book during their studies under Jesus. I think the evidence of the life and trials of Jesus Christ are well documented.
If you believe in God or not, or believe that Jesus walked on water is one thing. The facts are that Jesus walked the Earth, followed by a flock of people who documented his life. These documents help to make up the Bible, a book of books.
P.S. It should be GNU/Linux-help as Linux is the kernel and final piece to the puzzle, but GNU is the open source project that set out to build the operating system. Much like the Bible, a collection of work is reduced to a single name and many are confused to it's origin.
gnu.org
| by Richard Stallman @ gnu.org |
Most free software projects have the goal of developing a particular program for a particular job. For example, Linus Torvalds set out to write a Unix-like kernel (Linux); Donald Knuth set out to write a text formatter (TeX); Bob Scheifler set out to develop a window system (the X Window system). It's natural to measure the contribution of this kind of project by specific programs that came from the project.
If we tried to measure the GNU Project's contribution in this way, what would we conclude? One CD-ROM vendor found that in their ``Linux distribution'', GNU software was the largest single contingent, around 28% of the total source code, and this included some of the essential major components without which there could be no system. Linux itself was about 3%. So if you were going to pick a name for the system based on who wrote the programs in the system, the most appropriate single choice would be ``GNU''.
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[Updated on: Mon, 24 July 2006 19:21] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: hope none of you are them [message #209524 is a reply to message #209491] |
Mon, 24 July 2006 08:58 |
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mrpirate
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Location: Ontario
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| Reborn wrote on Mon, 24 July 2006 06:47 |
| mrpirate wrote on Sun, 23 July 2006 21:46 |
The statements "believe in no god" and "do not believe in god" seem to logically imply each other, to me. Further, theism is defined as the belief in a god or gods, so, naturally, atheism is not believing in a god or gods. I don't know why you think that atheism implies having no beliefs whatsoever.
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The fact that he believes no God exists means he is acting on faith.
If he simply "did not believe in any Gods", then it would of meant he had a lack of faith in the their existance.
The difference is subtle, but quite important. There is a big difference between positively believing that a thing does not exist, and simply lacking belief in it's existence.
Because I am saying he is acting on faith, I am saying he has a religion, he has positive belief in the non-existence of God. I am implying he is a theist at heart, not that atheism means having no beliefs.
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OK, dude. If you don't believe in a god, then it follows that you believe there is no god. I'm not sure how you don't see this. If I do not eat anything, then it follows that I eat nothing. Since no one will ever know if there's a god or not, ANY opinion you have on god(s) whatsoever amounts to faith. Finally, the existence of faith does not make a person a theist unless that faith is in a god.
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